[Spellyans] Introducing Penny Squire

nicholas williams njawilliams at gmail.com
Fri Jul 11 11:45:39 IST 2008


Wales is always the surname of the Prince of Wales and of his children.
When Edward VII went to Paris en garçon (followed at a distance by the  
Secret Service)
the various actresses used to greet him with his name: "Wales!"

Nicholas

On 11 Jul 2008, at 10:45, Ken MacKinnon wrote:

> It's the army basically.  And if you have ever served time in the  
> army it is
> only one of any number of batty things.
>
> servitudes et gloires militaires -  an Ken ken
>
>
> (Prof) Ken MacKinnon,
> Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
> The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
> Ross-shire  IV7 8HX
> Tel: 01349 - 863460
> E-mail: kenmackinnon at enterprise.net
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Craig Weatherhill" <weatherhill at freenet.co.uk>
> To: "Standard Cornish discussion list" <spellyans at kernowek.net>
> Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 5:52 PM
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] Introducing Penny Squire
>
>
>> Yes, Penny, I've read John Angarrack's latest as well - and have good
>> reason to know that he has very much hit upon the truth.  The  
>> "Windsor"
>> bit is intriguing (although his real surname is Saxe-Coburg-Gotha or,
>> paternally, Battenburg) - so how come his sons are William and Harry
>> Wales?  What is that about?  Is it a legal change of name under Deed
>> Poll?  Or, basically, why?
>>
>> KK pronunciation is not an easy subject, because there is more than
>> one.  There is the pronunciation recommended by Ken George in his
>> published material - and there is that which is used by almost  
>> every KK
>> user, including Ken George which is, in fact, the pronunciation of
>> Unified Cornish.
>>
>> The SWF with traditional forms is not, in my view, a disaster.  There
>> are things that are fundamentally wrong with it, hence this Spellyans
>> list, but nothing that can't be put right.  The real disaster is the
>> fact that there are two forms, the "main" form retaining some KK
>> graphs.  I presume this is why they dropped the original title  
>> "Single"
>> Written Form and replaced it with "Standard" Written Form.
>>
>> Craig (Marhak on C24, if you hadn't already twigged)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Penny Squire wrote:
>>> Please bear in mind that for several years I have been to and fro
>>> between Cornwall and other places rather a lot, so have been less in
>>> touch than I would have preferred.
>>>
>>> Having said that, I have, when possible, been ploughing through any
>>> and every discussion I could access on what was going on (in  
>>> addition
>>> to actually learning the language!) including Cornwall 24, as well  
>>> as
>>> looking at George, Gendall, Williams and Chaudhri.
>>>
>>> From what I can gather the Partnership may have been following a
>>> political agenda of " let's fudge something, it means government
>>> money" - great for the boys and girls employed by Cornwall Council,
>>> not so great for the language.
>>>
>>> I'm not, however, discounting actual malice ("let's blow the money  
>>> on
>>> conferences, pander to non-speakers, sideline Cornish speakers and
>>> homegrown experts and fly in outside experts, preferably ones that  
>>> are
>>> not too expert, produce a shambles and really stuff the language") -
>>> Eric Brook is, after all, a colleague of Doris Ansari (anyone who
>>> doesn't know about La Ansari and her anti-Cornish agenda shouldn't  
>>> be
>>> on this list!) and Bert Biscoe lost the plot on the Assembly  
>>> campaign
>>> long ago and has obviously failed to come to any sort of  
>>> understanding
>>> about the language.
>>>
>>> Having read John Angarrack's latest I wouldn't be surprised if Big
>>> Ears Windsor had a hand in it, either.
>>>
>>> I have read the so-called report the Commission produced and have  
>>> seen
>>> more valuable documents hanging on the nail in Granny's outside  
>>> privy.
>>> I'm not a linguist, but one hardly needs to be to see that they  
>>> were,
>>> as my uncle Tony the builder would say, 'shitty workers'. It's a  
>>> pity
>>> linguists aren't covered by the Trade Descriptions Act.
>>>
>>> Essentially I have no confidence whatsoever in the process which led
>>> to the SWF. It looks as if it were modelled on government public
>>> consultation exercises which are a total sham - the public has its  
>>> say
>>> which is totally ignored and some back office hack produces a  
>>> hideous
>>> plan which please nobody, doesn't work and costs the taxpayer a bomb
>>> to build after going way over budget.
>>>
>>> As for the SWF itself - I imaging any linguist with a knowledge of
>>> Brythonic languages would tear it apart.
>>>
>>> I am not an expert on linguistics - but trying to design  an
>>> orthography to reflect how second language learners and speakers
>>> brought up on divergent phonologies mispronounce Cornish has to be  
>>> the
>>> single most crazy linguistic  idea since whoever it was built the
>>> tower of Babel. What mutt dreamt that one up?
>>>
>>> Jon, in a previous post you said something to the effect that it was
>>> pointless discussing orthography design before agreeing on
>>> pronunciation. Go to the top of the class! I have laboured through  
>>> the
>>> postings on this list - I think you need to reiterate it - in  
>>> capitals!
>>>
>>> As I said in my introduction, I have been learning Cornish using
>>> Kernewek Kemmyn. I'd be interested to know how close the Spellyans
>>> group is to reaching conclusions on pronunciation, and if, where and
>>> why it differs from KK.
>>>
>>> I shall be away for ten days or thereabout and will catch up on my
>>> return.
>>>
>>> Penny
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>> From: Jon Mills <j.mills at email.com>
>>> To: Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, 9 July, 2008 8:44:02 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] Introducing Penny Squire
>>>
>>> I'd be interested to hear why you think the SWF is a disaster,  
>>> Penny.
>>> Jon
>>>
>>>    ----- Original Message -----
>>>    From: "Penny Squire"
>>>    To: spellyans at kernowek.net
>>>    Subject: [Spellyans] Introducing Penny Squire
>>>    Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:08 +0000 (GMT)
>>>
>>>    Hello, I'm Penny Squire and I've been studying Cornish for a
>>>    while, partly through KDL using Kemmyn and partly by looking at
>>>    everything I could lay my hands on.  Unfortunately I have been in
>>>    and out of Cornwall a lot over the past few years, so classes and
>>>    exams were out, and conversational experience has been crammed in
>>>    whenever possible. Hopefully this may change before long.
>>>
>>>    I also have some UC and LC material which I picked up here and
>>>    there and I have looked at some of the MC texts, so I am
>>>    reasonably aware of the different spellings. I have not studied
>>>    linguistics but have a smattering of languages and am pretty good
>>>    at hearing differences in dialects.
>>>
>>>    In my opinion the SWF is a disaster! I don't see how it can be
>>>    fixed, but I gather that some believe that it may be possible.
>>>    I'm willing to hear everyone's views - which is why I'm here.
>>>
>>>    Penny
>>>
>>>     
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>>>
>>> _____________________________________
>>> Dr.. Jon Mills,
>>> School of European Culture and Languages,
>>> University of Kent
>>>
>>>
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