[Spellyans] au

Ken MacKinnon kenmackinnon at enterprise.net
Thu Jul 24 10:30:44 IST 2008

Most interested in your revison of place-names list, Craig.   I would be 
very keen to receive this when it is ready.

I was presented with a full set of the Kesva placenames booklets when I did 
my 2000 study.   I could immediately see that many of them were 
unsatisfactory on all sorts of grounds - and that this represented 
essentially an amateur approach.   I have always felt that the failure to 
publish Gover's placenames book was a considerable failing on the part of 
the EPNS.  When Oliver retired I said I hoped he would get this published as 
priority.  He siad he wanted to revise it as further scholarship had 
overtaken some of Gover's work.  However we still await this opus.  I can 
imagine that Oliver is beavering away - but you can beaver away for ever on 
that sort of thing and submerge without trace beneath the detail,   never to 
emerge with the finished product.  I very much hope that your revised list 
will see early publication.  Otherwise it's Gresham's Law: bad money drives 
out good.

I would hope very much as a priority that a commission for Cornish 
placenames might be constituted as an ealy priority of developments now the 
SWF has been announced.    If it is, I very much trust that it will comprise 
actual professional experts and persons with actual track record in the 

I feel that your application for Menhyr as a bardic name was rightly turned 
down - but for the wrong reason.   A menhyr is an artefact.   Craig refers 
to a natural and conspicuous stone feature.   It is Creag in Gaelic and is 
feminine in gender - and so is its derivation carraig.   As is also its 
Cornish cognate carrek.  There is of course clegar - which Nicholas gives as 
feminine but Nance as masculine.   You may have had a lucky escape.

gorhemmynadow - Ken

(Prof) Ken MacKinnon,
Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
Ross-shire  IV7 8HX
Tel: 01349 - 863460
E-mail: kenmackinnon at enterprise.net

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Craig Weatherhill" <weatherhill at freenet.co.uk>
To: "Standard Cornish discussion list" <spellyans at kernowek.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Spellyans] au

> In their booklet on place-name recommendations, the Kesva tended to
> replace <au> with <ow>, so we had "Mownan", "Mowgan", "Lanvowsedh" for
> what was traditionally Maunan, Maugan and Lanvausa (St Mawes).  Then
> they went and replaced <ew> with <ow> in the name Trenewan which,
> historically, has been Trenewien 1207; Trenywyan 1310; Trenywyen 1422;
> Trenewyen 1424; Trenewen c. 1523 (presumably tre + personal name).  One
> wonders why they did not recommend Trenywyen in accordance with their
> own system, and which would have found an historical match from 1422.
> The SWF system would now have <o> for KK <ow>, so we would be looking at
> Monan, Mogan and Lanvosa/Lanvosedh (admittedly, for Mawgan-in-Meneage,
> we do have the spelling Pluvogan), which is why I advocate the
> restoration of <au>, and am doing so in my place-name recommendation
> document.
> Speaking of which, do those to whom I sent the provisional list of 3,400
> toponyms, have any comments?  If so, could I have them ASAP, if not
> sooner?  Grassa dhewgh.
> Craig
> Michael Everson wrote:
>> At 07:45 +0100 2008-07-24, Ken MacKinnon wrote:
>>> Maybe because Austria is an anglicisation of Oesterreich from
>>> Germnan Ost, ostern.  = east
>> The English translation is "Eastric" or possibly "Eastreach". :-)
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