[Spellyans] 'flood'

Nicholas Williams njawilliams at gmail.com
Wed Mar 11 14:29:23 GMT 2009


In a word, no. Lywe, lyw and lew appear to have a final [w]. So there
were probably two form lyw and lyv.

On 3/11/09, Jon Mills <j.mills at email.com> wrote:
> Nicholas,
>  When one asserts that something "is not likely" that implies that there is quantitative evidence to support the assertion. However your evidence is not quantitative. Instead you provide an analogy with the words 'knyvyas' and 'knew'. Of course, this example assumes that the <w> is not actually pronounced [v]. Your analogy with Lhuyds "kynyphan" and -knowek found in toponyms suggests that alternation might exist between [v] ~ [w] in some Cornish words. Such alternation between kynyphan and -knowek does not necessarily entail corresponding alternation between a putative 'lyw' and and its plural 'lyvyow'. Given that we have the singular form <lyf> attested in the Ordinalia, and <Lyv> given by Lhuyd, don't you think that it is safer to assume that the final <-w> in CW and Tregear in fact represents [v].
>  Ol an gwella,
>  Jon
>
>
>  > ----- Original Message -----
>  > From: "Nicholas Williams" <njawilliams at gmail.com>
>  > To: "Standard Cornish discussion list" <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>  > Subject: Re: [Spellyans] 'flood'
>
> > Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:49:58 +0000
>  >
>  >
>  > But it is not likely that CW lyw/lywe and Tregear's lew both had [v].
>  > I believe the final segment was [w]. Cf. Lhuyd's kuniviaz 'to shear'
>  > and Tregear's
>  > the vos knevys y knew the veis 'to have his fleece shorn off' TH 23.
>  > Here the verb is knevyas, knevys but the noun is knew.
>  > A further instance is Lhuyds kynyphan 'nut' but -knowek 'nutty' in toponyms.
>  >
>  > Nicholas
>  >
>  > On 3/11/09, Michael Everson <everson at evertype.com> wrote:
>  > > On 11 Mar 2009, at 13:09, Jon Mills wrote:
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > > Middle Cornish <w> sometimes represents [v]. Given that we have
>  > > attestations with final <-f>, I think we can assume that this word ends in
>  > > [-v]. Incidentally, Lhuyd (1707: 54c) writes "Lyv". The pronunciation is
>  > > [lɪv].
>  > > >
>  > >
>  > >  I'd tend to prefer "lyv" to "liv" or "lyw" for this ord.
>  > >
>  > >  Michael Everson * http://www.evertype.com
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
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