[Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

Craig Weatherhill craig at agantavas.org
Thu Jul 22 22:59:05 IST 2010


There's a copy of Wmffre's book is in St Just library.  I've only had  
a cursory look so far but it looks a bit strange.  I'll take it out  
and have a good look.

Craig


On 22 Gor 2010, at 21:21, ewan wilson wrote:

> Dear Folks,
>
> Sadly my old rattle-bones of a computer just won't open up the link  
> to this fascinating topic of  /l/ /ll/ and /lh/ sounds. Is the last  
> one related in any way to Welsh /ll/?
>
> References to both the late Seamus O'Coilean's Cornish thesis and  
> Iwan Wmffre's Handbook are most tantalising. It's made me go back  
> and look again at my cherished copy of Tavas A Ragadazow though I  
> had made the decision to get seriously stuck into Unified once and  
> for all while awaiting the finalised version of the  SWF  which I  
> believe is due to be hammered out ( or finely honed?!) in 2012. I'm  
> not sure why folk keep saying learning LC isn't easy. It strikes me  
> as a deal simpler than dear, old UC.
> Incidentally, in pursuit of disciplined acquisition I had also  
> decuded to do Hilary Shaw's course but I got no reply. Anyone have  
> her current contact details? I'll include stamp for reply this time!
>
> Pup bennath! ( ben nath?!)
>
> Ewan.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Daniel Prohaska
> To: 'Standard Cornish discussion list'
> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 3:30 PM
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
> (1576)
>
> Ken,
> I’m not familiar with Seamus Ó Coileán’s thesis at all and would  
> very much be interested in it. Where can I find it? Have you read  
> Iwan Wmffre’s “Handbook of Late Cornish”? Also very interesting.
> Dan
>
> From: Ken MacKinnon
> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 11:24 AM
>
> A gowetha,
>
> I wonder whether any professional empirical studies have ever been  
> undertaken on the remaining 'native speakers' of the West Penwith  
> dialect.  People like Nance have urged that this dialect is the  
> nearest thing we have to the sound system of late Cornish.   That  
> said, it surely deserves some serious study, and I wonder whether  
> there has been any serious proposal to research it.
>
> In 1990 Seamus O Coilean successfully presented a BA (Hons) by  
> Independent Study thesis at the Polytechnic (now University) of East  
> London, entitled 'Late Cornish - an accurate reconstruction for the  
> sound system'.  I have read this and I wonder whether others are  
> familar with it.  It presented some interesting and original ideas,  
> and I would be interested to know what others may have thought about  
> it.
>
> - Ken
>
>
> Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-
>
> ken at ferintosh.org
> and also at:-
> ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com
>
> My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.
>
> (Prof) Ken MacKinnon
> Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
> The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
> Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
> Scotland  UK
>
> Tel: 01349 - 863460
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: j.mills at email.com
> To: spellyans at kernowek.net
> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 8:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
> (1576)
>
> Is this one example the only evidence for "the survival of geminate  
> [ll] in the St. Ives dialect of Anglo-Cornish well into the 20th  
> century" (Bock 2010: 3)? Or is there further evidence?
> Ol an gwella (or should that be gwelha?)
> Jon
>
> _____________________________________
> Dr. Jon Mills,
> School of European Culture and Languages,
> University of Kent
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Craig Weatherhill <craig at agantavas.org>
> To: Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
> Sent: Wed, Jul 21, 2010 7:00 pm
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
> (1576)
>
> I must have mentioned the late Cecil Roberts of Sennen Cove, who  
> would pronounce the LL of "Scilly' as though he were saying "still  
> life". Dick Gendall heard and noted him, too. Terry George, also of  
> Sennen Cove and the former lifeboat cox'n, pronounces "enys" (as in  
> Enys Dodnan) as "ain-ez" ("ai" as in "air").
>
> Craig
>
>
> On 21 Gor 2010, at 17:18, Ray Chubb wrote:
>
> > I think one thing we can be sure of is that the St Ives >  
> pronunciation certainly did not come from English.
> >
> > On 21 Gor 2010, at 12:24, j.mills at email.com wrote:
> >
> >> Comments please on Bock's recent paper.
> >> http://homepage.univie.ac.at/albert.bock/archive/l_ll_lh_SA.pdf
> >>
> >> Ol an gwella,
> >> Jon
> >> _____________________________________
> >> Dr. Jon Mills,
> >> School of European Culture and Languages,
> >> University of Kent
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Spellyans mailing list
> >> Spellyans at kernowek.net
> >> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
> >
> > Ray Chubb
> >
> > Portreth
> > Kernow
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Spellyans mailing list
> > Spellyans at kernowek.net
> > http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>
> -- 
> Craig Weatherhill
>
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--
Craig Weatherhill





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