[Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

Daniel Prohaska daniel at ryan-prohaska.com
Fri Jul 23 10:45:54 IST 2010


Thanks for this, Ken. Much appreciated.

Dan

 

  _____  

From: Ken MacKinnon
Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 6:43 PM
To: Standard Cornish discussion list
Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

 

Dan,

 

I imagine that the thesis is in the library of the University of East London.   It would be worthwhile to check this out.  Unfortunately Seamus died about 5 years or so ago - so I cannot check with him.   I was with a Celtic group in London ( London Association for Celtic Education )  at that time, which met at the Roger Casement Centre in Highgate.   Of that group the best contact would be Peter Berresford Ellis:-

 

Peter Berresford Ellis
E-mail Address(es):
  pd at cosmocelt.co.uk

 

It would be valuable to see whether Seamus's thesis is retrievable or if a copy exists anywhere else.

 

Seamus did the graphics for Celtic League and Carn - also for my own research effort SGRUD.  His passing was a great loss to the Celtic movement - and I very much trust that his thesis has not beeen lost in the process.

 

I attach the logo Seamus did for me. You may recognise the style.   I was getting him to do some further grpahic work for me when he died.

 

Oll an gwella - Ken

 

 

Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-

 

ken at ferintosh.org
and also at:-
ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com

 

My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.

 

(Prof) Ken MacKinnon
Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
Scotland  UK

 

Tel: 01349 - 863460

 

 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Daniel <mailto:daniel at ryan-prohaska.com>  Prohaska 

To: 'Standard <mailto:spellyans at kernowek.net>  Cornish discussion list' 

Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 3:30 PM

Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

 

Ken, 
I’m not familiar with Seamus Ó Coileán’s thesis at all and would very much be interested in it. Where can I find it? Have you read Iwan Wmffre’s “Handbook of Late Cornish”? Also very interesting.

Dan

 


  _____  


From: Ken MacKinnon
Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 11:24 AM

 

A gowetha,

 

I wonder whether any professional empirical studies have ever been undertaken on the remaining 'native speakers' of the West Penwith dialect.  People like Nance have urged that this dialect is the nearest thing we have to the sound system of late Cornish.   That said, it surely deserves some serious study, and I wonder whether there has been any serious proposal to research it.

 

In 1990 Seamus O Coilean successfully presented a BA (Hons) by Independent Study thesis at the Polytechnic (now University) of East London, entitled 'Late Cornish - an accurate reconstruction for the sound system'.  I have read this and I wonder whether others are familar with it.  It presented some interesting and original ideas, and I would be interested to know what others may have thought about it.

 

- Ken

 

 

Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-

 

ken at ferintosh.org
and also at:-
ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com

 

My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.

 

(Prof) Ken MacKinnon
Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
Scotland  UK

 

Tel: 01349 - 863460

 

 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: j.mills at email.com 

To: spellyans at kernowek.net 

Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 8:52 AM

Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

 

Is this one example the only evidence for "the survival of geminate [ll] in the St. Ives dialect of Anglo-Cornish well into the 20th century" (Bock 2010: 3)? Or is there further evidence?

Ol an gwella (or should that be gwelha?)

Jon

_____________________________________ 
Dr. Jon Mills, 
School of European Culture and Languages, 
University of Kent

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Weatherhill <craig at agantavas.org>
To: Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 21, 2010 7:00 pm
Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

I must have mentioned the late Cecil Roberts of Sennen Cove, who would pronounce the LL of "Scilly' as though he were saying "still life". Dick Gendall heard and noted him, too. Terry George, also of Sennen Cove and the former lifeboat cox'n, pronounces "enys" (as in Enys Dodnan) as "ain-ez" ("ai" as in "air"). 
 
Craig 
 
 
On 21 Gor 2010, at 17:18, Ray Chubb wrote: 
 
> I think one thing we can be sure of is that the St Ives > pronunciation certainly did not come from English. 
> 
> On 21 Gor 2010, at 12:24, j.mills at email.com wrote: 
> 
>> Comments please on Bock's recent paper. 
>> http://homepage. <http://homepage.univie.ac.at/albert.bock/archive/l_ll_lh_SA.pdf> univie.ac.at/albert.bock/archive/l_ll_lh_SA.pdf 
>> 
>> Ol an gwella, 
>> Jon 
>> _____________________________________ 
>> Dr. Jon Mills, 
>> School of European Culture and Languages, 
>> University of Kent 
>> _______________________________________________ 
>> Spellyans mailing list 
>> Spellyans at kernowek.net 
>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net 
> 
> Ray Chubb 
> 
> Portreth 
> Kernow 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> Spellyans mailing list 
> Spellyans at kernowek.net 
> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net 
 
-- 
Craig Weatherhill 
 
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