[Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter (1576)

Craig Weatherhill craig at agantavas.org
Fri Jul 23 16:03:39 IST 2010


Have done, Ken, and got it. too.  Thanks, Dan.  It's not quite the  
same as the one in St Just library, which has an extensive glossary in  
the back.  Have also got the newly issued SWF glossary from MAGA (and  
an SWF/T glossary is also available - big well done to those who  
pushed for it, because it wasn't originally intended).

Craig



On 23 Gor 2010, at 15:32, Ken MacKinnon wrote:

> Yes, Craig - but Dan says do not circulate to others without his  
> permission. So you would be best to ask him direct.
>
> - Ken
>
> Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-
>
> ken at ferintosh.org
> and also at:-
> ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com
>
> My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.
>
> (Prof) Ken MacKinnon
> Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
> The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
> Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
> Scotland  UK
>
> Tel: 01349 - 863460
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Weatherhill" <craig at agantavas.org 
> >
> To: "Standard Cornish discussion list" <spellyans at kernowek.net>
> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:06 PM
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
> (1576)
>
>
> Wonderful. Could I ask for a copy, please?
>
> Craig
>
>
> On 23 Gor 2010, at 11:46, Ken MacKinnon wrote:
>
>> Craig wheg,
>>
>> I have just had a post from Dan Prohaska with a pdf of Iwan  
>> Wmffre's Handbook attached.
>>
>> - Ken
>>
>>
>> Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-
>>
>> ken at ferintosh.org
>> and also at:-
>> ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com
>>
>> My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.
>>
>> (Prof) Ken MacKinnon
>> Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
>> The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
>> Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
>> Scotland  UK
>>
>> Tel: 01349 - 863460
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Weatherhill" <craig at agantavas.org
>> >
>> To: "Standard Cornish discussion list" <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 10:59 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter   
>> (1576)
>>
>>
>> There's a copy of Wmffre's book is in St Just library.  I've only had
>> a cursory look so far but it looks a bit strange.  I'll take it out
>> and have a good look.
>>
>> Craig
>>
>>
>> On 22 Gor 2010, at 21:21, ewan wilson wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Folks,
>>>
>>> Sadly my old rattle-bones of a computer just won't open up the   
>>> link  to this fascinating topic of  /l/ /ll/ and /lh/ sounds. Is   
>>> the last  one related in any way to Welsh /ll/?
>>>
>>> References to both the late Seamus O'Coilean's Cornish thesis  
>>> and   Iwan Wmffre's Handbook are most tantalising. It's made me go  
>>> back   and look again at my cherished copy of Tavas A Ragadazow  
>>> though I   had made the decision to get seriously stuck into  
>>> Unified once and   for all while awaiting the finalised version of  
>>> the  SWF  which I   believe is due to be hammered out ( or finely  
>>> honed?!) in 2012.  I'm  not sure why folk keep saying learning LC  
>>> isn't easy. It  strikes me  as a deal simpler than dear, old UC.
>>> Incidentally, in pursuit of disciplined acquisition I had also    
>>> decuded to do Hilary Shaw's course but I got no reply. Anyone  
>>> have   her current contact details? I'll include stamp for reply  
>>> this time!
>>>
>>> Pup bennath! ( ben nath?!)
>>>
>>> Ewan.
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Daniel Prohaska
>>> To: 'Standard Cornish discussion list'
>>> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 3:30 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
>>> (1576)
>>>
>>> Ken,
>>> I’m not familiar with Seamus Ó Coileán’s thesis at all and would    
>>> very much be interested in it. Where can I find it? Have you  
>>> read   Iwan Wmffre’s “Handbook of Late Cornish”? Also very  
>>> interesting.
>>> Dan
>>>
>>> From: Ken MacKinnon
>>> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 11:24 AM
>>>
>>> A gowetha,
>>>
>>> I wonder whether any professional empirical studies have ever been  
>>> undertaken on the remaining 'native speakers' of the West Penwith  
>>> dialect.  People like Nance have urged that this dialect is the    
>>> nearest thing we have to the sound system of late Cornish.    
>>> That   said, it surely deserves some serious study, and I wonder  
>>> whether   there has been any serious proposal to research it.
>>>
>>> In 1990 Seamus O Coilean successfully presented a BA (Hons) by  
>>> Independent Study thesis at the Polytechnic (now University) of   
>>> East London, entitled 'Late Cornish - an accurate reconstruction   
>>> for the sound system'.  I have read this and I wonder whether   
>>> others are familar with it.  It presented some interesting and   
>>> original ideas,  and I would be interested to know what others  
>>> may  have thought about  it.
>>>
>>> - Ken
>>>
>>>
>>> Ken MacKinnon is now on Broadband  with new e-mail addresses:-
>>>
>>> ken at ferintosh.org
>>> and also at:-
>>> ken.ferintosh at googlemail.com
>>>
>>> My former e-mail addresses are no longer able to be used.
>>>
>>> (Prof) Ken MacKinnon
>>> Ivy Cottage, Ferintosh,
>>> The Black Isle, by Dingwall,
>>> Ross-shire  IV 7 8HX
>>> Scotland  UK
>>>
>>> Tel: 01349 - 863460
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: j.mills at email.com
>>> To: spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2010 8:52 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
>>> (1576)
>>>
>>> Is this one example the only evidence for "the survival of   
>>> geminate [ll] in the St. Ives dialect of Anglo-Cornish well into   
>>> the 20th century" (Bock 2010: 3)? Or is there further evidence?
>>> Ol an gwella (or should that be gwelha?)
>>> Jon
>>>
>>> _____________________________________
>>> Dr. Jon Mills,
>>> School of European Culture and Languages,
>>> University of Kent
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Craig Weatherhill <craig at agantavas.org>
>>> To: Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>>> Sent: Wed, Jul 21, 2010 7:00 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] <l>, <ll>, and <lh> in Sacrament an Alter  
>>> (1576)
>>>
>>> I must have mentioned the late Cecil Roberts of Sennen Cove, who    
>>> would pronounce the LL of "Scilly' as though he were saying  
>>> "still   life". Dick Gendall heard and noted him, too. Terry  
>>> George, also  of  Sennen Cove and the former lifeboat cox'n,  
>>> pronounces  "enys" (as in  Enys Dodnan) as "ain-ez" ("ai" as in  
>>> "air").
>>>
>>> Craig
>>>
>>>
>>> On 21 Gor 2010, at 17:18, Ray Chubb wrote:
>>>
>>> > I think one thing we can be sure of is that the St Ives >
>>> pronunciation certainly did not come from English.
>>> >
>>> > On 21 Gor 2010, at 12:24, j.mills at email.com wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Comments please on Bock's recent paper.
>>> >> http://homepage.univie.ac.at/albert.bock/archive/l_ll_lh_SA.pdf
>>> >>
>>> >> Ol an gwella,
>>> >> Jon
>>> >> _____________________________________
>>> >> Dr. Jon Mills,
>>> >> School of European Culture and Languages,
>>> >> University of Kent
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Spellyans mailing list
>>> >> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> >> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>> >
>>> > Ray Chubb
>>> >
>>> > Portreth
>>> > Kernow
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Spellyans mailing list
>>> > Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> > http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Craig Weatherhill
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Spellyans mailing list
>>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Spellyans mailing list
>>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Spellyans mailing list
>>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Spellyans mailing list
>>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>
>> --
>> Craig Weatherhill
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Spellyans mailing list
>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Spellyans mailing list
>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>
> --
> Craig Weatherhill
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Spellyans mailing list
> Spellyans at kernowek.net
> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> Spellyans mailing list
> Spellyans at kernowek.net
> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net

--
Craig Weatherhill





More information about the Spellyans mailing list