[Spellyans] Is there a future for the SWF?
daniel at ryan-prohaska.com
Tue May 15 14:34:07 BST 2012
Sorry "Craig" --- bloody Mac spell checker….
On May 15, 2012, at 3:15 PM, Daniel Prohaska wrote:
> Thanks, Craif, very helpful, keep 'em coming!!!
> This indeed points towards a front rounded vowel for earlier Middle Cornish. Of course the tendency would be to unround at a comparatively early date as the word occurs in the unstressed second element. The lexeme would have retained the rounding longer, yet the earliest textual attestation is from 1611, in CW ‹cleath›.
> On May 15, 2012, at 2:02 PM, Craig Weatherhill wrote:
>> CARGLOTH: Carglodan 1375; Cargluthan 1432; Carglothe 1590; Carglith 1748. ker + cledh (dim. form).
>> BOLSTER BANK: Cleuth 1602; Cleath, Clay 1733; Kleth 1740; Cleath, Kleth 1778.
>> (MENGLETH, "quarry")
>> PIT'S MINGLE: (no available historic forms)
>> Maengluthion 1320 (Roche - lost place-name)
>> Pengluthio 1575 (Ladock - lost place-name. Questionable if this is a pl. form of *mengleth)
>> (MONGLETH, "open-cast mine")
>> MONGLEATH: Mungluth 1308, 1350, 1530; Mongluthe 1313; Mungleath, Mungloeth 1316; Moungleth 1460; Monglyth 1480; Monglegh 1499; Munglyth 1523; Mongler 1590; Mungleth 1623; Monglar 1766; Munglar 1804.
>> TRUNGLE: Trevonglet 1283; Trevongluth 1302; Trevengloth 1313; Trevingluth 1317; Trevungleith 1322; Trewonglyth 1395; Trewoyngluth 1428; Trevonglyth 1429, 1668; Trevounglethe 1561; Trevongleth, Treungle 1600, 1668; Treungle 1634 (+ tre-)
>> (NB. Late dropping of -th in both names)
>> On 15 Me 2012, at 11:22, Jon Mills wrote:
>>> How can one be sure that the element -gloth in Cargloth is the lexeme CLEDH?
>>>> Dan writes,
>>>> Here are the attestations:
>>>> cleath (CW), klêdh (Lh), cledh (Pr); (pl.) kledhioụ (Lh), cledhiou (Pr);
>>>> While there is no *cluth, *cloth, *clueth or *clevth which would point towards a front rounded vowel, the attestations clearly go back to the full grade */klœð/ root (B kleuz, W clawdd) as there is no reason for a i-mutated /klað/.
>>>> There is also the place name Cargloth where the second element does show a rounded vowel. Since all the textual attestations here are rather late it is not surprising that they would show */œ/ in its unrounded reflex. But since there's also the place name and I should agree with Craig that (critically examined) place names are highly relevant to the reconstruction of Cornish forms, we do have grounds to reconstruct */klœð/, hence SWFt ‹cleudh›. I should say ‹cleudh› is correct.
>>> Dr. Jon Mills,
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