[Spellyans] kemeres

Nicky Rowe nickyrowe at gmail.com
Mon May 14 17:02:23 IST 2012


Yes it's stressed as pellGOWSer, but the idea is that the pell has a slight
stress because it's a word within a word instead of just a syllable of a
word. So the pel in pelednow has no stress, because it's part of the word
pellen. But because pellgowser is a compound word made up of pell and
cowser, the pell has a slight secondary stress that keeps pell intact.

Whether this secondary stress existed or not in traditional Cornish I
haven't the foggiest, but for the purposes of the SWF, there 'tis.

Nicky



On 14 May 2012 01:50, A. J. Trim <ajtrim at msn.com> wrote:

>   Nicky,
>
> Thanks. However, I’m not convinced that <*pellgowser*> can have a
> secondary stress on the first syllable, even though the SWF spec. says that
> it does. Surely, it’s stressed as pell*GOWS*er.
>
> Should the <-*he*> words all be written as two words, e.g. <*gwadn he*>, <
> *gwell ha*>, <*spladn howgh*> , <*ombèll hes*>, etc.?
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Andrew J. Trim
>
>
>   *From:* Nicky Rowe <nickyrowe at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 13, 2012 9:30 PM
> *To:* Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>
>
>> However, if the prefix ends in a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and
>> ‹rr›), the double letter is retained, e.g. <*kollverk*> "an apostrophe",
>> "*kollverkys*> "apostrophes".
>>
>
> This is a compound word "loss mark" like pellgowser and pednglin. The SWF
> spec says they have "secondary stress".
>
> -he words also keep secondary stress, i.e. gwellhe, gwadnhe, etc (same as
> KS). The reason for this comes from *gwadn hez *used in Nebbaz Gerriau.
>
> Nicky
>
>
>
> On 13 May 2012 00:50, A. J. Trim <ajtrim at msn.com> wrote:
>
>> **
>> I find that this system is quite difficult. Perhaps it is just a lack of
>> explanation. My examples are from MAGA's new  .pdf  dictionary:
>>
>> With some words, we get the expected result, e.g. <*bomm*> "a blow"/"a
>> crash", <*bommel*> "a buffer", <*bomellow*> "buffers".
>>
>> It's not quite as simple as that.
>> Sometimes we have a prefix that ends in the same letter as the word to
>> which it is prefixed, e.g. <*howllennow*> "parasols". This is quite
>> reasonable.
>>
>> Sometimes we have a prefix with a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn›
>> and ‹rr›), e.g. <*kemmyn*> "common", <*kemynskrif*> "a will". So far, so
>> good.
>>
>> However, if the prefix ends in a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and
>> ‹rr›), the double letter is retained, e.g. <*kollverk*> "an apostrophe",
>> "*kollverkys*> "apostrophes".
>> At first, this appears to be at odds with <*bomellow*> above. Then we
>> have <*koloryon*> "a male loser" which seems to conform.
>> We have <*jynner*> "a male mechanic" but <*jynores*> "a female
>> mechanic". These are derivatives of <*jynn*> "engine".
>> Then we have <*jynnweyth*> "machinery" and <*jynnweythek*> "mechanical",
>> where <*jynn*> is a prefix in a compound word.
>> We also have <*gwellhe*> "to improve". Are we saying that this is a
>> compound word rather than a derivative?
>> I also found <*ombellhe*> "to withdraw" and <*ollgallosow*> (apparently
>> the plural of <*ollgallos*> "an omnipotence".)
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Andrew J. Trim
>>
>>
>>
>>  *From:* Daniel Prohaska <daniel at ryan-prohaska.com>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, May 12, 2012 1:51 AM
>>  *To:* Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>> *Subject:* Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>>
>> Double consonants in pre-tonic, unstressed position are only simplified
>> in the cases of ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and ‹rr›.
>> Dan
>>
>>  On May 11, 2012, at 11:17 PM, A. J. Trim wrote:
>>
>>  However:-
>>
>> This is different from the SWF <*attes*> "comfort" but <*attesva*>
>> "comfort station" / "lavatory".
>> Why is this not <*atesva*>?
>>
>> We also have SWF <*attamya*> "to tackle", <*abattiow*> "abbeys", <*
>> addyansow*> "additions", <*Bouddieth*>*  "Buddhism", <*apperya*> "to
>> feature", and <*robbyoryon*> "robbers".
>> Why do we have a double letter after an unstressed vowel in these words?
>>
>> [ * Also, why not <*Bouddiedh*>* . Does this have something in common
>> with <*nowyth*>? As I understand it, the SWF rule is final <-*dh*> when
>> unstressed.]
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Andrew J. Trim
>>
>>
>>
>>  *From:* Nicholas Williams <njawilliams at gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, May 10, 2012 2:54 PM
>> *To:* Standard Cornish discussion list <spellyans at kernowek.net>
>> *Subject:* Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>>
>> No. The <mm> or <bm> is written only after a stressed vowel.
>> After an unstressed vowel as in <kemeres> the consonant is written
>> singular.
>> This is the same as dallath but dalethys, or tyller but tyleryow,
>> cannas/cadnas but canasow.
>>
>> Nicholas
>>
>>
>>  On 10 May 2012, at 14:47, Jon Mills wrote:
>>
>> Should it not be written *kemmeres / kebmeres* ?
>>
>>
>>
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