[Spellyans] kemeres

Daniel Prohaska daniel at ryan-prohaska.com
Tue May 15 00:00:17 IST 2012


Sorry Nicky. I hadn't seen that you'd already answered this.
Dan


On May 14, 2012, at 6:02 PM, Nicky Rowe wrote:

> Yes it's stressed as pellGOWSer, but the idea is that the pell has a slight stress because it's a word within a word instead of just a syllable of a word. So the pel in pelednow has no stress, because it's part of the word pellen. But because pellgowser is a compound word made up of pell and cowser, the pell has a slight secondary stress that keeps pell intact.
> 
> Whether this secondary stress existed or not in traditional Cornish I haven't the foggiest, but for the purposes of the SWF, there 'tis.
> 
> Nicky
> 
> 
> 
> On 14 May 2012 01:50, A. J. Trim <ajtrim at msn.com> wrote:
> Nicky,
>  
> Thanks. However, I’m not convinced that <pellgowser> can have a secondary stress on the first syllable, even though the SWF spec. says that it does. Surely, it’s stressed as pellGOWSer.
>  
> Should the <-he> words all be written as two words, e.g. <gwadn he>, <gwell ha>, <spladn howgh> , <ombèll hes>, etc.?
>  
>  
> Regards,
>  
> Andrew J. Trim
>  
>  
> From: Nicky Rowe
> Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2012 9:30 PM
> To: Standard Cornish discussion list
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>  
> However, if the prefix ends in a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and ‹rr›), the double letter is retained, e.g. <kollverk> "an apostrophe", "kollverkys> "apostrophes".
> 
> This is a compound word "loss mark" like pellgowser and pednglin. The SWF spec says they have "secondary stress".
> 
> -he words also keep secondary stress, i.e. gwellhe, gwadnhe, etc (same as KS). The reason for this comes from gwadn hez used in Nebbaz Gerriau.
> 
> Nicky
> 
> 
> 
> On 13 May 2012 00:50, A. J. Trim <ajtrim at msn.com> wrote:
> I find that this system is quite difficult. Perhaps it is just a lack of explanation. My examples are from MAGA's new  .pdf  dictionary:
>  
> With some words, we get the expected result, e.g. <bomm> "a blow"/"a crash", <bommel> "a buffer", <bomellow> "buffers".
>  
> It's not quite as simple as that.
> Sometimes we have a prefix that ends in the same letter as the word to which it is prefixed, e.g. <howllennow> "parasols". This is quite reasonable.
>  
> Sometimes we have a prefix with a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and ‹rr›), e.g. <kemmyn> "common", <kemynskrif> "a will". So far, so good.
>  
> However, if the prefix ends in a double letter (i.e. ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and ‹rr›), the double letter is retained, e.g. <kollverk> "an apostrophe", "kollverkys> "apostrophes".
> At first, this appears to be at odds with <bomellow> above. Then we have <koloryon> "a male loser" which seems to conform.
> We have <jynner> "a male mechanic" but <jynores> "a female mechanic". These are derivatives of <jynn> "engine".
> Then we have <jynnweyth> "machinery" and <jynnweythek> "mechanical", where <jynn> is a prefix in a compound word.
> We also have <gwellhe> "to improve". Are we saying that this is a compound word rather than a derivative?
> I also found <ombellhe> "to withdraw" and <ollgallosow> (apparently the plural of <ollgallos> "an omnipotence".)
>  
>  
> Regards,
>  
> Andrew J. Trim
>  
>  
>  
> From: Daniel Prohaska
> Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2012 1:51 AM
> To: Standard Cornish discussion list
> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>  
> Double consonants in pre-tonic, unstressed position are only simplified in the cases of ‹ll›, ‹mm›, ‹nn› and ‹rr›.
> Dan
>  
> On May 11, 2012, at 11:17 PM, A. J. Trim wrote:
> 
>> However:-
>>  
>> This is different from the SWF <attes> "comfort" but <attesva> "comfort station" / "lavatory".
>> Why is this not <atesva>?
>>  
>> We also have SWF <attamya> "to tackle", <abattiow> "abbeys", <addyansow> "additions", <Bouddieth>*  "Buddhism", <apperya> "to feature", and <robbyoryon> "robbers".
>> Why do we have a double letter after an unstressed vowel in these words?
>>  
>> [ * Also, why not <Bouddiedh>* . Does this have something in common with <nowyth>? As I understand it, the SWF rule is final <-dh> when unstressed.]
>>  
>>  
>> Regards,
>>  
>> Andrew J. Trim
>>  
>>  
>> 
>> From: Nicholas Williams
>> Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2012 2:54 PM
>> To: Standard Cornish discussion list
>> Subject: Re: [Spellyans] kemeres
>>  
>> No. The <mm> or <bm> is written only after a stressed vowel.
>> After an unstressed vowel as in <kemeres> the consonant is written singular.
>> This is the same as dallath but dalethys, or tyller but tyleryow, cannas/cadnas but canasow.
>>  
>> Nicholas
>>  
>>  
>> On 10 May 2012, at 14:47, Jon Mills wrote:
>> 
>>> Should it not be written kemmeres / kebmeres ?
>> 
>>  
>>  
>>  
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