[Spellyans] SWF review results.

Clive Baker clive.baker at gmail.com
Wed Mar 26 13:11:05 GMT 2014


I should add that I was not chairman at the time of the vote, and we did
not abstain, rather we dissaproved the changes proposed as we felt they
were a backward move...hope that clarifies the matter
Clive Baker

Well said Christian...I ,as the recently elected chairman of Agan Tavas,
agree with you entirely...
Clive Baker
On Mar 26, 2014 10:42 AM, "Christian Semmens" <christian.semmens at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I not sure a hands off policy will work. Really I think Jon has hit the
> nail on the head. It is time to rock the boat. A simple rejection of the
> SWF in its proposed form, by Agan Tavas, would suffice to put the cat
> amongst the pigeons. You wouldn't have to say never, just to say that the
> SWF is an unacceptable orthography because of x, y and z. The SWF only has
> relevance if it is a consensus orthography. Unfortunately without parity
> for traditional graphs and the move towards consolidation of the KK
> aspects, it fails to be of any utility for those of us who would wish to
> use a traditional orthography.
>
> If it is allowed to continue without immediate and explicit challenge than
> the only outcome in the medium term (the next twenty years) is Jon's option
> 1. Traditional orthographies will be a splintered hobbyist way of spelling
> Cornish and the mainstream will use the KK form. We will have failed
> utterly. Waiting for people to see the light will not work. What is
> academically acceptable is irrelevant in this scenario. It is the 'boots on
> the ground' that count
>
> If, as I suspect, very few others here *want* to use it in its current
> form, then that needs to be flagged up. I simply won't use it and I know
> there are at lest a few more people here that feel that way too. We need a
> larger group to represent our position and to fight for a traditional
> orthography. Otherwise we are easily dismissed individually as malcontents.
> Perhaps you could poll your members and see what their feelings are? That
> would be interesting.
>
> It may be that they are in favour of capitulation, in which case I won't
> stress over it any more and will visit the grave of traditional Cornish
> every time I come home whilst trying not to look at the hideous caricature
> of Cornish daubed on the road signs.
>
> Christian
>
>
> On 25 March 2014 14:37, Ray Chubb <ray at spyrys.org> wrote:
>
>> The official Agan Tavas position as adopted at the AGM is that, apart
>> from changes that Late Cornish users find desirable and the issue of
>> diacritical marks, the SWF should be left as it is.
>>
>> This decision is on the basis that the changes proposed are very few and
>> tend to make the SWF less authentic than it already is.
>>
>> It was suggested at our committee meeting today that another 5 years
>> should elapse before changes are made. Hopefully in 5 years time people
>> will be able to look at it in a rational and scholarly way and leave behind
>> any baggage that they are carrying from the past.
>>
>>
>> On 24 Mer 2014, at 21:53, Craig Weatherhill wrote:
>>
>>  I managed to get these today.  Many items are "no change", so I've
>>> singled out those in which a change was decided upon.  The below is given
>>> in SWF/M for convenience, but the status of Traditional graphs remain
>>> unaltered.
>>>
>>> DOUBLE CONSONANT SPELLINGS.
>>> 1.  Introduce <ll> and <rr> in roots.  Do not revert to single letter in
>>> unstressed non-final syllables where that changes the root.
>>> 2.  Introduce <ll> for <dell>, <-ell> for the suffix which implies
>>> 'tool' or 'device', e.g., dewynnell, draylell, gwariell, hornell,
>>> karrigell, musurell, pibell, rostell, skitell, skubell, skwychell,
>>> tempredhell, torgentrell, yeynell.
>>>
>>> SHORT <o> and <u>
>>> 1. Change to <o> in <arlodh>, in line with <toll>, <tomm>, <boka>,
>>> <bronn>, <koska>
>>>
>>> <GH> and <H>
>>> 1. <gh> everywhere except word-initially.
>>>
>>> PARTICLE <th> in SWF/L
>>> 1. Join particle with verb as in <thera>, without a gap.
>>>
>>> PARTICLE (ow>- RLC VARIANT <o>
>>> 1. Retain <o> (present participle), but drop the apostrophe.
>>>
>>> <NOWYTH>
>>> 1. To be respelt <nowydh> (M), or <nowedh>.
>>>
>>> HYPHENS
>>> 1.  Remove hyphens from numbers, particles and some other words, e.g.
>>> <ebost>.
>>> 2.  Add hyphens in loose compounds of the form 'noun + verbal noun',
>>> e.g. <jynn-skrifa>, <skath-wolya>, etc.
>>> 3.  <poslev/poslevow> to replace <poos-lev/poos-levow>.
>>> 4.  <erbynn> to replace <er-bynn>.
>>> (but personal use to remain optional).
>>>
>>> VOWEL LENGTH IN MONOSYLLABIC LOAN WORDS ENDING -p OR -t.
>>> 1.  To be written as <pp>, <tt> if they contain a short vowel.
>>> 2.  Accept both permissible plural endings, e.g. <hattys/hattow>
>>>
>>> DHYWORTH/DYWORTH
>>> 1.  Accept <dhyworth> and <dyworth> as alternatives, and <dhort> and
>>> <dort> in RLC variants.
>>>
>>> A/OA ALTERNATION
>>> 1.  Remove RLC variants <toal>, <kloav>, <gwoav>, <gwloan>, spelling
>>> them only with -a-.
>>> 2.  Add <boas>, <doas>, <moas> in RLC variants to the remaining <broas>.
>>>
>>> <OO> for KK <OE>
>>> 1.  <goolan> to become <golan>.  Otherwise, no change.
>>>
>>> <kk> AND <ck>
>>> 1.  <ck> to be used in all borrowings; <kk> in all other cases,
>>> including those in doubt.
>>> 2.  <okkupya> to be respelt <okupya>.
>>>
>>> APOSTROPHES IN RLC VARIANTS
>>> 1.  Retain before nouns like <'manyn>.
>>> 2.  Do not use elsewhere where the beginning of a word has been shed,
>>> e.g. <skydnya> from <dyskynna>.
>>> 3.  Do not use internally, e.g. <metern> from <myghtern> and <mos> from
>>> <mowes>.
>>> 4.  Do not use after <kal> (KK <kalgh>).
>>> 5.  May be used where -th, -dh is dropped, e.g. pro', for', warbar'.  To
>>> be left to the discretion of individual writers.
>>>
>>> <eu>
>>> 1.  Add SWF/L <enkladhva>, SWF/M <ynkladhva>  (presently SWF
>>> <ynkleudhva>).
>>> 2.  Allow <teudhi and <tedha> as alternative spellings.
>>> 3.  Add to SWF/L <bidhi> (currently <beudhi> only); and <briji>
>>> (currently <breuji> in SWF/L).
>>> No change to <breusi>, <Meurth>, <feusik>.
>>>
>>> GWR & GR (SWF/L VARIANT)
>>> 1.  Write <gwr-> in RMC and RLC, inclusing <gwra>, <gwruthyl>.
>>>
>>> GEMINATION & PROVECTION IN SUPERLATIVES/SUBJUNCTIVES
>>> 1.  Retain <tth>, introduce corresponding <ggh>, <cch>, <ssh>.
>>>
>>> WORTIWEDH, ETC.
>>> 1.  <wortiwedh/wostiwedh> and <wostalleth/wortalleth> to be single
>>> words, without apostrophes.
>>>
>>> 1ST PERSON SINGULAR
>>> 1  RC variant <me>, <ve>, no longer required.
>>>
>>>
>>> Craig
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Spellyans mailing list
>>> Spellyans at kernowek.net
>>> http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net
>>>
>>
>> Ray Chubb
>>
>> Portreth
>> Kernow
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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