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<p class=MsoPlainText><span class=SpellE><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Deiniol</span></font></span><font
color=navy><span lang=EN-GB style='color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'> a <span
class=SpellE>scrifas</span>:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>“An interesting point
here is that Manx and Cornish are not the only "British languages"
(in a strictly *geographical* sense) to exhibit pre-occlusion: it's also
abundantly attested for <span class=SpellE>Norn</span>, the extinct Scandinavian
language of the <st1:place w:st="on">Shetland Islands</st1:place>. As Michael
points out, pre-occlusion also obtains in Icelandic but not, IIRC, in Faroese, which
is interesting, as it's halfway between <span class=SpellE>Norn</span> and
Icelandic both geographically and linguistically. Given this, I have to doubt
if there's any direct influence between Man and <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City
 w:st="on">Cornwall</st1:City></st1:place> which could give rise to
pre-occlusion.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><span class=SpellE><font size=3 face=Gentium><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Deiniol</span></font></span><span
lang=EN-GB style='mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>”<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=3 color=navy
 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:
 EN-GB'>PO</span></font></st1:place><font color=navy><span lang=EN-GB
style='color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'> occurs in Faeroese. It may be
interesting to note that there apparently was a dialectal split in the
occurrence of <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place> in Shetland <span
class=SpellE>Norn</span>. The <st1:PlaceType w:st="on">island</st1:PlaceType>
of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on"><span class=SpellE>Foula</span></st1:PlaceName> of
the West Coast showed <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place> as did the western
seaboard of Mainland, but not in the East where /n<span class=GramE>:/</span>
and /<span class=SpellE>rn</span>/ become palatalised (perhaps something like
*/ɲ/) rather than pre-occluded.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>A sort of PO also
occurs in the South Bavarian dialect of <st1:place w:st="on">South Tyrol</st1:place>
where the clashing of root-final /n/ with plural /<span class=SpellE>ən</span>/
after the syncope of [ə]. Two /<span class=SpellE>nn</span>/ are left
creating the environment for <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place> as a way to
dissimilate the sounds, e.g. /<span class=SpellE>baɪ</span>/ ‘bee’,
/ˈ<span class=SpellE>baɪdn</span>/ ‘bees’ < *<span
class=SpellE>baɪnn</span> < *<span class=SpellE>baɪnən</span>.
Something similar may have occurred in Late Cornish two where the unstressed
syllable in <<span class=SpellE>benen</span>> was so weakened that the
second <e> dropped altogether leaving */<span class=SpellE>benn</span>/
which could then pre-occlude to /<span class=SpellE>bedn</span>/ in <span
class=SpellE>Borlase’s</span> <<span class=SpellE><i style='mso-bidi-font-style:
normal'><span style='font-style:italic;mso-bidi-font-style:normal'>bednvâz</span></i></span>>
along with the rest of the /nː/ that were part of the phonological system
of Western Cornish. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>I suspect that <st1:place
w:st="on">PO</st1:place> is something that develops spontaneously out of a <span
class=SpellE>phonologica</span> environment that has to do with strong stress
on the one hand and geminate consonants on the other. The development of PO in
Western Scandinavian (Icelandic, Faeroese, western Shetland <span class=SpellE>Norn</span>;
- don’t know about south-western <st1:country-region w:st="on">Norway</st1:country-region>)
share this development and they are connected as <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place>
occurs in the same environment under the same conditions in a very similar set
of words. It is still possible that <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place>
developed individually out of common tendencies and seafaring contact with each
other. Contact between <span class=SpellE>Foula</span> and the Faeroes is
attested and also that the respective dialects were mutually comprehensible. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>I find it hard to
imagine that Manx PO has nothing to do with western Scandinavian PO, after all
Man was partially Norse speaking for a long time and settled by mainly Norwegian,
i.e. western Scandinavian, speakers. Their phonology may have initialised the
development of a Manx-specific type of <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>South Tyrolean PO
cannot be connected to Western Scandinavian and this example shows that <st1:place
w:st="on">PO</st1:place> is not as uncommon a development in languages as one
may think and can develop individually in different non-connected speech areas
spontaneously. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>We can also see
that a smallish language community can show a dialectal split where one dialect
has PO and the other <span class=GramE>doesn’t,</span> observable in
Shetland <span class=SpellE>Norn</span>; furthermore some south Tyrolean
dialects do not show <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place> while others do not. I
do not know whether <st1:place w:st="on">PO</st1:place> occurs in northern
Tyrolean dialects. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>This is the kind of
dialectal split that Nicholas proposes to have been one of the contrasting
features of western and central/eastern Cornish. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Dan<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 color=navy face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB;mso-fareast-language:
DE'>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: spellyans-bounces@kernowek.net [mailto:spellyans-bounces@kernowek.net] On
Behalf <span class=GramE>Of</span> <span class=SpellE>Deiniol</span> Jones<br>
Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2011 1:17 AM<br>
To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Standard Cornish discussion list</st1:PersonName><br>
Subject: Re: [<span class=SpellE>Spellyans</span>] <span class=SpellE>gawas</span>
'to get'</span></font><font color=navy><span lang=EN-GB style='color:navy;
mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>On 7 Sep 2011, at 22:31, Craig
Weatherhill wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> That is strange regarding
the pre-occlusion in Manx.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>Only
one<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> British tongue has <span
class=GramE>it,</span> only one Gaelic tongue has it.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>It's hard to<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> see whether one
influenced the other.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>Sea-trading
might be one<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>possibility</span>,
but that trade would also have called into <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
 w:st="on">Wales</st1:place></st1:country-region>,<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Ireland</st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region w:st="on">Scotland</st1:country-region>
and <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Brittany</st1:place></st1:State>.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>They have no trace of it.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>Maybe<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>those</span>
languages had so many speakers that they were beyond minor<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>external</span>
influences - but Manx would not have been, having perhaps<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>as</span>
few speakers as Cornish did.<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><span
class=GramE>And vice-versa, of course.</span><span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>From<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>whence</span>
came the influence?<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><st1:City
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Cornwall</st1:place></st1:City> to Man, or the
other way<span style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>round</span>?<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>  </span>If there is a connection between the two
developments of pre- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>> <span class=GramE>occlusion</span>,
then that's the only one I can think of.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>An interesting point here is
that Manx and Cornish are not the only "British languages" (in a
strictly *geographical* sense) to exhibit pre-occlusion: it's also abundantly
attested for <span class=SpellE>Norn</span>, the extinct Scandinavian language
of the <st1:place w:st="on">Shetland Islands</st1:place>. As Michael points
out, pre-occlusion also obtains in Icelandic but not, IIRC, in Faroese, which
is interesting, as it's halfway between <span class=SpellE>Norn</span> and
Icelandic both geographically and linguistically. Given this, I have to doubt
if there's any direct influence between Man and <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City
 w:st="on">Cornwall</st1:City></st1:place> which could give rise to
pre-occlusion.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><span class=SpellE><font size=3 face=Gentium><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Deiniol</span></font></span><span
lang=EN-GB style='mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><span class=SpellE><font size=3 face=Gentium><span
lang=EN-GB style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Spellyans</span></font></span><span
lang=EN-GB style='mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'> mailing list<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>Spellyans@kernowek.net<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face=Gentium><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-ansi-language:EN-GB'>http://kernowek.net/mailman/listinfo/spellyans_kernowek.net<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

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