[Spellyans] a vry

Chris Parkinson brynbow at btinternet.com
Thu Nov 7 19:20:56 GMT 2013

I take your point about colloquial language in the plays. But one last
question – if you don’t think the spoken language is substandard, then why
were the type of changes that I enumerated in May made in Chapter 40 of
Desky Kernowek to many LC examples?  Your doing this has evidently given us
the wrong impression.



From: Spellyans [mailto:spellyans-bounces at kernowek.net] On Behalf Of
Nicholas Williams
Sent: 07 November 2013 18:36
To: Standard Cornish discussion list
Subject: Re: [Spellyans] a vry


Of course I don't think the spoken language is substandard.

I do, however, think that Lhuyd's own Cornish is a very poor model indeed.
Have you ever read his preface in AB from beginning to end?

Would any teacher really use the following as a text from which to learn for


MI a uôr por-dha (Pednzhivìkio Skientek) bôz mêr an gyndan uarnav, dho’ îl
dheugh en le kenzama

neb Apolog py esgyzianz, rag kemeraz uarnav dho Skrefa ha gora ’mêz Gramatek
ha ger-levran

Kernûak, pan nag ou vi na genez en Pou Kernou, na huâth tregyez en an
’Ulâz-ma mûi vel padzhar

mîz. An guirioneth yu hemma. Mi a vev Kelmez heruedh Gorhemmen neb Arlodho
ha pednzhivìkio

Kembra, ha nepre erel dre ol an G’làskor-ma, dho skrefa ketella kalzha vi,
uar an Tavaz Brethonek

(po kotha Lavar an Enez-ma) nèpeth moy try veva skrefyz arâg, gen an mêr-fyr
ha’n mêr-skientek

A’hro an Deskadzher Davies, ha nepre erel abar’h Brethonek Kembrîan.


The sentences which Lhuyd records from other people are quite a different
matter, e.g.


Me a vedn gàs gweles arta gordhuwher AB: 244c

Ujy gàs tas byw? AB 246a

Yw an vowes-na gàs whor? AB: 246

Yw hodna gàs whor why? AB 244c

Yma ev pòr haval dhis AB 242b,


etc. etc.


The point about such sentences from the spoken language, however, is that
they are not Lhuyd's; they were merely recorded by him.

We are also grateful to Lhuyd for preserving the whole of Jowan Chy an
Hordh. In several cases, however, Lhuyd did not understand what he heard in
the tale.


The fact is that the plays are full of colloquial language, they were after
all composed to be heard, not read.


Te falge horsen [n]am brag vy

avond tellek theth cregy 

You false son of a bitch, don't threaten me.

Buzz off, you ragamuffin, hang you!

BM 3491-9


is a good example. 


It is a canard to suggest that Middle Cornish is literary while Late Cornish
is colloquial. Gendall has made such a claim, but it is not supported by the






On 7 Nov 2013, at 17:51, Chris Parkinson wrote:

Do you think he failed to an extent that makes his material too suspect to
use as a model? 


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